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#1 NightshadeArabs

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 03:39 AM

As I have only ever squared up stock type horses for fun, I was wondering if I could get any tips on training Arabian horses (of various ages) to pose correctly?
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#2 Aimbri

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 01:59 PM

If, when you say "stock type" you mean QH, then the main difference is that the QH's are backed into a pose, while an Arabian is stepped up into a pose.

Of course there is a LOT more to getting your horse ready to show than posing them. Lots of conditioning . . . body condition, and coat condition. Of course the basics of being haltered and led are in place, and the horse has learned to respect your "personal space" and only enters it at your invitation.

I start my young horses similar to how one would work with a showmanship horse. Lots of leading until they are responsive to the handler on a loose lead. They walk when I walk, they trot when I trot, they stop when I stop and so on. I turn them away from me, and towards me. I lead them from either side. I back them. I ask them to walk forward when I'm in front of them, and I'm backing. They learn the proper space between us. Once they've mastered that, then I ask them to "WHOA" while I walk around them on a loose lead. Everytime they try to move, I tell them whoa! It takes some time for them to realize WHEN you want them to walk off, and when you want them to stand. Once they master this, I stand in front of them, and teach them to step up a step or two at a time, until I get their leg positions correct. This is all over the course of many days or weeks of lessons, of course. I use my voice first. If they don't respond, I use a shank (NO chain - just a plain halter). Then slowly, they become more responsive to the body language. It's hard to explain, but it's a process. They have to have complete trust in you, and confidence that they are pleasing you. So . . . lots of "atta boys" and pats and scratches when they get it right! Once you've got them standing with the leg position the way you want it, it's time to teach them to pose and give(show) their neck. Now that you have "Whoa" established, they will learn to plant their feet, and lean forward a bit for a treat or a crunchie held in your whip hand, so they learn to reach to the whip, but . . . they have to come up and out, and not lean in too much. THIS can be a difficult and time-consuming process. Some horses "get it" right away. Some take a while. Once all this is in place, you can fine tune it a bit by changing to no or very little voice commands, and almost ALL body language.

Don't spend more than 10 minutes at a lesson (less for youngsters), and ALWAYS end on a good note. If they just can't get something, and either you or they are getting frustrated, switch to something that you KNOW they can excell at, even for a few seconds, praise them, and end on a good note. Put them away, and try again later. If they aren't ready for the show . . . there WILL be another show!

Other people will have different methods. I would LOVE to hear what others do!

Jeannette
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All horses at Aimbri Arabians are SE and AK, and all mares and stallions are LFS, CA and SCID Tested Clear!
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Tammens Nadira (Tammen x ADH Nadafe by Shukri) 1995 Bay  
Aimbri Ansarah (Aseffa Moniet by Rasmoniet RSI x Zahara Basharah by Ramses Maris) 1996 Bay
MB Faheena (Safeen x AK Bint Fatiha by Moniet El Sharaf) 1997 Ches. 
Aimbri Amira Matrabb (El Matrabb x Dorian Mon Amie by AK Na Moniet) 1998 Ches/Flax 
Aimbri Zaafinah (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Ansarah) 2004 Ches/Flaxen 
Aimbri Amurra (Moon Sheine x MB Faheena) 2005 Ches. SOLD!
Aimbri Fawzia (Moon Sheine x Tammens Nadira) 2005 Ches/Flaxen
Aimbri Zakirah (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Ansarah) 2006 Bay SOLD!
Aimbri Amira Alia (Moon Sheine x MB Faheena) 2006 Ches/Flaxen
Aimbri Bint Bint Matrabb (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Amira Matrabb) 2011 Ches.

2 SE/AK Sweepstakes Nominated Chestnut Geldings by El Matrabb  SOLD! $
Aimbri Emir Hilal (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Amira Matrabb by El Matrabb) 2007 Ches. $


#3 Cheryl L

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 02:46 PM

Here are the techniques that I use and have been using for almost 20 years. I have written them down for 2 different forums, now I will print them here:

During the winter, is the time to start training your horses for halter. Tie them and brush them good. Put a regular halter on and use a captive chain, wrap in guaze or vet wrap for the babies if you so choose. You are NOT going to "shank" your horse. Just walk around and every time you stop lift your lead hand up high quickly and tell them whoa. This should slightly startle them and they should stop. Pat them and tell them good. Cluck and walk, tell them good, keep sessions short ,end on a good note and always brush them afterwards. Do this untill they automatically stop every time that you lift your hand. Don't forget to praise and cluck for them to walk again. Now extend the time that they have to whoa. If you have to correct them for moving, just lift your hand and say whoa. This is a very important step and should not be taken lightly, you cannot judge a horse that will not stand still. You also should be used to carrying a halter whip in your left hand. Whether you chose to show with a whip or not your horse needs to be used to one, they will be all around you in the ring. Your next lesson will be to walk your horse and the handler will turn in front of the horse, walk backwards and raise your hand to whoa. This will start to teach your horse to stand in front of you. Don't forget hand raised ,whoa, and Praise. When they learn to stand while you are in front of them, you are going to cluck and walk backwards, everytime you raise your hand they should stop. Praise. Next. You will walk backwards watch their backfeet. when the hind leg on your left side starts to lift tell them whoa. This should stagger that foot forward. Praise. Remember don't start the next step untill the last lesson is solid. Now when you walk backwards lift your hand and your horse should stop with that back leg on your left staggered forward. Now you are going to teach your horse to bring his front legs forward. You will do this with pulling on the lead rope to the right and cluck, if they move a back leg tell them Whoa, start again, eventually they will move the front left leg forward. This will take patience and a lot of resetting the back legs. Lots of Praise. Then you will teach them to move the other leg by pulling to the right. When this happens everytime you have now taught your horse to stand for show. Remember when you want movement, cluck. Now when you have your horse "set up", you will have a treat in your left hand with the whip. You need to find a cue that works for you. We use the SSSSSSS noise. Hold the whip with the treat bring it to your horses nose and let him eat it. Use very small bites, and use your cue. Praise. Each time move your hand a little farther away. Keep your hand up in the air. Remember movement of the feet is not allowed so you will need to correct them, set them back up and start over.. When this is solid, start backing off of the treats and make them give their necks more times before a treat. They should focus on the whip and your cue
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#4 Aimbri

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 03:03 PM

Thanks, Cheryl, for your input. As I've said, there are so many different ways to do things.

For instance, I NEVER use a cluck or clicking sound to simply ask my horses to move. For my horses, a click/cluck means only ONE thing. To trot. A kissy soung means to canter/lope. I use words/voice for almost everything else. I teach my horses the word "come" to have them follow me anywhere. Into a trailer, a new place, that sort of thing. When I say "come" they follow me. When I want them to step sideways, I teach them "Over". They learn to move away from me. "Step Up" means to step forward. "Back" means to step back, and so on. "Quit" is when they are doing something NOT OK! "Easy" means for them to slow down.

One tape that I have is the Kim Potts tape. Some good tips on there. I also have other tapes from other trainers/handlers. Some are outdated, and a bit old fashioned, but some of the information is still useful and some is very valuable. I've also attended many clinics over the years. I always learn something new at every clinic.

The BEST way to learn is to watch what others are doing, and how their horses react. You can see what you would LIKE your horse to react like, and, sadly, what you would NOT like your horse to react like.

The most important thing is that you do NOT want your horse to react out of fear, but because they want to please you and earn your praise.
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Jeannette
Aimbri Arabians
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All horses at Aimbri Arabians are SE and AK, and all mares and stallions are LFS, CA and SCID Tested Clear!
Colt:

Aimbri El Kaream (REA El Kaream+ x Tal Imdal by Imperial Imdal+) 2013 grey colt LFS, CA and SCID tested Clear.

Mares:

Tammens Nadira (Tammen x ADH Nadafe by Shukri) 1995 Bay  
Aimbri Ansarah (Aseffa Moniet by Rasmoniet RSI x Zahara Basharah by Ramses Maris) 1996 Bay
MB Faheena (Safeen x AK Bint Fatiha by Moniet El Sharaf) 1997 Ches. 
Aimbri Amira Matrabb (El Matrabb x Dorian Mon Amie by AK Na Moniet) 1998 Ches/Flax 
Aimbri Zaafinah (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Ansarah) 2004 Ches/Flaxen 
Aimbri Amurra (Moon Sheine x MB Faheena) 2005 Ches. SOLD!
Aimbri Fawzia (Moon Sheine x Tammens Nadira) 2005 Ches/Flaxen
Aimbri Zakirah (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Ansarah) 2006 Bay SOLD!
Aimbri Amira Alia (Moon Sheine x MB Faheena) 2006 Ches/Flaxen
Aimbri Bint Bint Matrabb (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Amira Matrabb) 2011 Ches.

2 SE/AK Sweepstakes Nominated Chestnut Geldings by El Matrabb  SOLD! $
Aimbri Emir Hilal (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Amira Matrabb by El Matrabb) 2007 Ches. $


#5 Aimbri

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 03:14 PM

Something I should mention, so that you get an opportunity to practice and kind of "desensitize" your horse to it a bit is the "hazing". It is now allowed to "haze" the horses into the ring. From what I understand, at the Vegas Show there was actually hazing IN the ring. "Hazing" is chasing the horse in using a whip with a plastic bag tied onto the end of it. Then they chase the horse in, a get them "pumped up" by waving, pounding the bag against the ground and so on. Also, some are pounding the boards along the arena, and hooting, whistling and shouting so loud that it could scare the liver out of you, let alone your horse.

I showed a 2 yr old at the Western Canadian Breeders in 2008. The Hazing, the boards pounding and the hooting were SOOOOOO loud in there that it was almost deafening. I had NOT practiced this at home, as I do NOT have an indoor arena, so . . . be warned.
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Jeannette
Aimbri Arabians
Visit My Website

All horses at Aimbri Arabians are SE and AK, and all mares and stallions are LFS, CA and SCID Tested Clear!
Colt:

Aimbri El Kaream (REA El Kaream+ x Tal Imdal by Imperial Imdal+) 2013 grey colt LFS, CA and SCID tested Clear.

Mares:

Tammens Nadira (Tammen x ADH Nadafe by Shukri) 1995 Bay  
Aimbri Ansarah (Aseffa Moniet by Rasmoniet RSI x Zahara Basharah by Ramses Maris) 1996 Bay
MB Faheena (Safeen x AK Bint Fatiha by Moniet El Sharaf) 1997 Ches. 
Aimbri Amira Matrabb (El Matrabb x Dorian Mon Amie by AK Na Moniet) 1998 Ches/Flax 
Aimbri Zaafinah (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Ansarah) 2004 Ches/Flaxen 
Aimbri Amurra (Moon Sheine x MB Faheena) 2005 Ches. SOLD!
Aimbri Fawzia (Moon Sheine x Tammens Nadira) 2005 Ches/Flaxen
Aimbri Zakirah (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Ansarah) 2006 Bay SOLD!
Aimbri Amira Alia (Moon Sheine x MB Faheena) 2006 Ches/Flaxen
Aimbri Bint Bint Matrabb (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Amira Matrabb) 2011 Ches.

2 SE/AK Sweepstakes Nominated Chestnut Geldings by El Matrabb  SOLD! $
Aimbri Emir Hilal (Moon Sheine x Aimbri Amira Matrabb by El Matrabb) 2007 Ches. $


#6 Cheryl L

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 03:20 PM

We play with grocery bags tied to lunge whips at home. This is our liberty game. We chase the horses with the lunge whips and baggies and when we are done.....we raise our hand up in the air and say Okay Good boys come on!
We have all sorts of goodies, whether it is apples, carrots or whatever. Every horse comes in to the raised hand and gets a treat. We don't chase them after that. The whip is still there with the baggie on it and we have to make sure we hang onto it, because one of the Arabs will take off with it and shake it around.
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#7 NightshadeArabs

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 06:19 PM

I wonder what they would think if the horse didn't spook when they shook the bags etc, one of the first things I do with all my youngsters is take a bag on the end of my dressage type whip (no lash) and wiggle it around and on them until they calm down, that and various other sacking out. I take my horses out on the trail and don't need an explosion over blowing trash.
Thanks for all the tips, that's kind of what I was doing with my stud to pose him, so its good to know I had the right idea.
Keep the info coming, I am a sponge!
Cordy Brannan
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#8 Angella

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 04:16 AM

Here are the techniques that I use and have been using for almost 20 years. I have written them down for 2 different forums, now I will print them here:

During the winter, is the time to start training your horses for halter. Tie them and brush them good. Put a regular halter on and use a captive chain, wrap in guaze or vet wrap for the babies if you so choose. You are NOT going to "shank" your horse. Just walk around and every time you stop lift your lead hand up high quickly and tell them whoa. This should slightly startle them and they should stop. Pat them and tell them good. Cluck and walk, tell them good, keep sessions short ,end on a good note and always brush them afterwards. Do this untill they automatically stop every time that you lift your hand. Don't forget to praise and cluck for them to walk again. Now extend the time that they have to whoa. If you have to correct them for moving, just lift your hand and say whoa. This is a very important step and should not be taken lightly, you cannot judge a horse that will not stand still. You also should be used to carrying a halter whip in your left hand. Whether you chose to show with a whip or not your horse needs to be used to one, they will be all around you in the ring. Your next lesson will be to walk your horse and the handler will turn in front of the horse, walk backwards and raise your hand to whoa. This will start to teach your horse to stand in front of you. Don't forget hand raised ,whoa, and Praise. When they learn to stand while you are in front of them, you are going to cluck and walk backwards, everytime you raise your hand they should stop. Praise. Next. You will walk backwards watch their backfeet. when the hind leg on your left side starts to lift tell them whoa. This should stagger that foot forward. Praise. Remember don't start the next step untill the last lesson is solid. Now when you walk backwards lift your hand and your horse should stop with that back leg on your left staggered forward. Now you are going to teach your horse to bring his front legs forward. You will do this with pulling on the lead rope to the right and cluck, if they move a back leg tell them Whoa, start again, eventually they will move the front left leg forward. This will take patience and a lot of resetting the back legs. Lots of Praise. Then you will teach them to move the other leg by pulling to the right. When this happens everytime you have now taught your horse to stand for show. Remember when you want movement, cluck. Now when you have your horse "set up", you will have a treat in your left hand with the whip. You need to find a cue that works for you. We use the SSSSSSS noise. Hold the whip with the treat bring it to your horses nose and let him eat it. Use very small bites, and use your cue. Praise. Each time move your hand a little farther away. Keep your hand up in the air. Remember movement of the feet is not allowed so you will need to correct them, set them back up and start over.. When this is solid, start backing off of the treats and make them give their necks more times before a treat. They should focus on the whip and your cue


Does it have to be the left foot forward?

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#9 Cheryl L

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 05:09 AM

That would be the horses back right foot and no it does not have to be the one. I always use the same technique, so all of our horses will automatically set themselve with the back right foot forward. I am very methodical in the way that I train. The grooming sessions before and afterwards, not only relaxes a horse for a training sessions and puts them in a good frame of mind, but creates a bond and teaches patience and ground manners while being tied. To me, it is all about setting a routine, with the exception of lunging/free lunging or long line/bit and lunge. That I like to switch around a bit.

I use one cluck to release the horse from the whoa. Now, in lunging or under saddle/harness, I use two clucks to trot.
One cluck and they walk in the long lines, 2 clucks and they trot, kiss to canter.
The other positive thing about lifting your hand to whoa.......when you are teaching them under saddle, you start to lift the rein and that automatically starts to signal a change and/or whoa.
Not one of our horses are afraid of the whip. They respect it, but if I need to swat that fly off of them, then I can swat it, they won't freak out because the whip touched them. Have I corrected a horse sharply with a whip? Yes, if the situation called for it. We are talking about an animal that weighs upwards of 800lbs and I want to be the boss.

#10 Kathy Bailey

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Posted 13 January 2010 - 12:42 AM

How much training is needed before a horse can be shown in a halter class? For example a weanling to be trained to eventually be shown in a 1 year old class?

#11 Kristine

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Posted 13 January 2010 - 09:18 PM

Does it have to be the left foot forward?


I always train mine with the hind right foot forward and the hind left foot back (as most peopleand as those who posted above)

I believe most people show this way because the first view of your horse standing up is usually when the horse is on the rail (facing counter clockwise) with the judge viewing from the middle. This means the first side profile the judge will see is of the horse's left side.

by having the left foot be the foot they have farther back than the right, it paints a picture of a long hip and flat croup.

Also back when certainother techniques were used for training, there were alot of "crouchers" in the ring, viewing from the left side with the left leg back didn't make it so obvious.

As far as age, you can start them anytime you want. I never make the sessions longer than about 7 mins on young horses.

Here is a youngster pictured at 4 months of age

He showed a week after this (with his mother at side) and won the yearling and under class as well as junior Champion Stallion/colt. He beat the TWO year olds!!! It was pretty neat to see him in there.

I have not seen too many weanlings shown though.

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#12 Cheryl L

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Posted 13 January 2010 - 10:46 PM

Kathy.....I started Shamal when he was 9 months old. He had just come out of quarantine and had not been handled in a month and was a filthy mess and shy. His first experience with us was getting a warm water bath in the freezing cold, to get the crap that was hanging off of his belly 4 inches, off.
Then I started to halter train him.....just like my instructions above. He picked it up pretty fast. In fact a lot of it was done after work, in the dark driveway lit by a vapor light. It really helped us to build a bond, while teaching him leading and ground manners.

#13 Kathy Bailey

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Posted 13 January 2010 - 11:59 PM

I guess I meant from start to finish, how long does it take to train for? 30 days 60 days? like how long before they are reliably ready?

#14 Kristine

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 12:06 AM

Horses should be reliably standing up pretty quickly (less than a month) but then you spend time perfecting it, with good communication skills you can teach them to "show". They learn to tighten thier muscles, suck up the tummy, level the topline and give the "look". For some horses this comes right away, with others a few months.

The training is not what takes the time, it is the conditioning, conditioning yearlings is long and slow, you have to be so careful with them. The more time you have, the better.

The easiest yearlings to condition are the ones who have had plenty of room to run, a great balanced diet and that all amazing work ethic that this breed is rarely without. (we are all so lucky)

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#15 Kathy Bailey

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Posted 14 January 2010 - 12:33 AM

from this information I think I'll wait till he's a bit older before I do anything like that.

Thanks :)

#16 Tranquil Morning

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Posted 30 January 2010 - 04:52 AM

Wow- thanks to everyone's tips on training. I'm new to the halter training. I've done showmanship with my arabs in open shows a few times...but am really looking forward to showing them in halter. So far, what I've done with Rhafiik seems to be right on track (phew!) Now, I'm anxious for some better weather (okay, at least above freezing!) to work with him some more. He's so quick at picking up new skills, and we are learning together!
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#17 ponygirl

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 04:03 AM

great thread wish I had discovered it sooner.
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