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#1 wildcat180

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Posted 03 September 2010 - 02:01 PM

I hope I am starting this topic in the right place...

I am looking for book suggestions to help me learn more about Arabians in general (are there books on SEs?), from conformation to pedigree and history. I would also like suggestions on good books to read for information on the various types of showing, but because I realize this alone could turn into a huge list, allow me to be more specific. I'd like books that focus on the types of showing that do not judge on showmanship or equitation. (I am a beginner in terms of riding ability and certainly would not want to be judged on it, but I am confident in my handling on the ground.) I would like to learn more about the in hand type of showing like sport horse in hand and halter. Are there any other types likes those two or are they the main ones?

I know there is little substitute for going to the shows and experiencing them in person, but I have not found one in my area in the near future. So, I'd like to pass the time by reading and getting what I can from those sources.

Thanks!

#2 Ray

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Posted 07 January 2011 - 02:21 AM

Hello Wildcat :umm:

There is a seemingly endless number of books out there. The really good ones were printed in the 1800's to early 1900's, are rare and expensive, assuming they could be found for sale. Samantha of Blue Pyramid Arabians has graciously maintained her list of book titles on her website. You can find that list and some other good info here: http://www.bpeah.com/Library.htm

Online information I find extremely useful is Edouard al-Dahdah's blog, which you will find here: http://daughterofthewind.org/ Within that blog are links to other great information.

Another wonderful source of invaluable information online is the CMK site - articles here: http://cmkarabians.com/articles/

And another delightful source of information is "For the love of a horse", by Ralph Suarez, found here: http://www.egyptiana...n.blogspot.com/ I see that Ralph has mentioned the SE import, *Serenity Shahra, who figures prominently in some of the horses I have from Serenity Farms. Thanks Ralph!

Here is a nice article on the Davenport stallion, Hanad: http://www.reocities...adLegacyRJ.html

I had a link to a Syrian Arabian website, but it appears to be down or broken. It was syrianarabianhorses dot com. Maybe someone else knows what's going on with that one? They had photos of some wonderful desert-breds that would make a Bedouin's head turn for a second look.

There is a brief history of the EAO (El Zahraa) here: http://www.elzahraa-...eg/History.html

There are some great books available from Al Khamsa, and a wonderful online roster of Al Khamsa (asil) horses here: http://www.alkhamsa.org/

More good info with The Institute for the Desert Arabian Horse here: http://www.desertarabian.org/

Here is info on the W. K. Kellogg Arabian Horse Library: http://www.csupomona.edu/~wkkahl/

And Diane has a lot of really useful information on her website here:
http://www.agecroft.com.au/

I guess that should keep you occupied for a little while.

#3 VanAlma

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Posted 07 January 2011 - 04:49 PM

Welcome :umm: It's nice to have people new to riding!
Anyway, while this isn't a book, youtube has many videos of in hand Sport Horse schooling and classes. It's pretty straight forward, and in my opinion, is easier to learn from watching something done than reading. The reading part would be needed for the specifics on what to judges look for in each part, which I have yet to search out, but will post if I find something.
I'm not a researcher so won't have suggestions for reading like Ray and many of the others.

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#4 Ray

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Posted 07 January 2011 - 05:35 PM

Welcome :roflmao: It's nice to have people new to riding!
Anyway, while this isn't a book, youtube has many videos of in hand Sport Horse schooling and classes. It's pretty straight forward, and in my opinion, is easier to learn from watching something done than reading. The reading part would be needed for the specifics on what to judges look for in each part, which I have yet to search out, but will post if I find something.
I'm not a researcher so won't have suggestions for reading like Ray and many of the others.


Great suggestion, Kate. I didn't include any references for the training aspects, which is a whole 'nuther ballgame. :laughing1:

#5 Lysette

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Posted 07 January 2011 - 05:49 PM

Here is a link to the books available from the Pyramid Society

http://www.pyramidso...s&pof_page_no=1

I always point people to Forbis' "The Classic Arabian" first. While some of the information is out of date (such as the remark that Egyptians (or Asils, can't remember the exact term used) carry no known genetic diseases), it gives a nice overview of a lot of history, includes pictures of a lot of famous horses, and it is realitively cheap and easy to get a copy of when compared to many other Arabian books.
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#6 wildcat180

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Posted 20 January 2011 - 10:39 PM

This is great information, thank you all!

Please allow me to add another aspect to this topic: information on researching pedigrees. I have datasource access and have used it to get the information I know to look for for my horses, but how do I get into figuring out the percentages of their ancestral elements? Or learn who's a good stallion/dam and determine dam lines and such? I am trying to learn how to research pedigrees by researching my two registered horses, Las Witez Dina, and Kayode. (Kayode died Christmas Eve, which has been hard to cope with and I've turned to digging around in his pedigree as a way to try and deal with it.)

#7 VanAlma

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 01:23 PM

This is great information, thank you all!

Please allow me to add another aspect to this topic: information on researching pedigrees. I have datasource access and have used it to get the information I know to look for for my horses, but how do I get into figuring out the percentages of their ancestral elements? Or learn who's a good stallion/dam and determine dam lines and such? I am trying to learn how to research pedigrees by researching my two registered horses, Las Witez Dina, and Kayode. (Kayode died Christmas Eve, which has been hard to cope with and I've turned to digging around in his pedigree as a way to try and deal with it.)

First of all, I am so sorry to hear of your loss. It is never easy, especially at that time of year :(
As for pedigree research, there is a thread on the discussion forum that has to do with percentages. I'll go on and re-bump it up again to make it easier to find (they sometimes all seem to run together) although there is no definitive answers for horses that are not Asil, so be prepared to get a headache if you want percentage calculations for Polish etc.
If all breed is correct, your Las Witez Dina is Egyptian/Crabbet on the sire's side, Crabbet/Polisd on the dam's side but I am not extremely well-versed, so someone more educated than myself might see something I have not.

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#8 Ray

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 05:12 PM

This is great information, thank you all!

Please allow me to add another aspect to this topic: information on researching pedigrees. I have datasource access and have used it to get the information I know to look for for my horses, but how do I get into figuring out the percentages of their ancestral elements? Or learn who's a good stallion/dam and determine dam lines and such? I am trying to learn how to research pedigrees by researching my two registered horses, Las Witez Dina, and Kayode. (Kayode died Christmas Eve, which has been hard to cope with and I've turned to digging around in his pedigree as a way to try and deal with it.)


The horses you listed are, ummm, "combined source", I guess. :tha_you6:

What you could do is start with Datasource. If the horse is shown there as Al Khamsa, then go to the Al Khamsa website roster and find the ancestral elements for qualifying horses. This should work for most of the SE, Crabbet/Blunt, Davenport, Babson, Doyle, various Blue Stars, etc.

For the Polish horses, go to the Janow Podlaski website, pedigree page:

http://www.janow.ara...digree-form.php

Here you will find the sire and dam lines listed. For instance, a look-up on Bask gives the following info:

breeder: Albigowa Stud, PL
sire line: Kuhailan Haifi d.b. 1923, b. Khalef el Aouad, imp. 1931 Gumniska (PL)
dam line: Mlecha d.b. ~1840, imp. 1845 Jarczowce (PL)

#9 wildcat180

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 06:32 PM

Yeah, my guys are a mish-mash of breeding, I know. :laughing1: I know there's nothing really special there besides the personality of and the love I feel for the horses attached to those pedigrees. I just figured it would be a good exercise in pedigree research since I would have to hit multiple resources. I really do appreciate the help on all counts!

I have gotten the information from Al Khamsa, though some of the horses listed in the Datasourse as AK do not show on the AK roster. I'll check out the other sites and see what I can find. Going back beyond the 5 generation pedigree on the DS, I've found quite a few names I recognize, so I should be able to find more information with little trouble.

So, with a SE, would the search begin and end on AK's roster? Or are there other sources for more information? I ask because I'm going to be bringing home LW Tawalas Amiri very soon and the thing I am finding is that I am really enjoying "getting to know" my horses' through their pedigrees. I don't breed, so I know it's of little consequence beyond my own curiosity, but it is fun! (I know, I'm a nerd because I *enjoy* research...)

#10 Ray

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 06:58 PM

What kinda "more" information are you thinking about?

That Minstril daughter you're bringing home is interesting in that her dam, AK Tawala, was pure-in-strain Saqlawi Jidran to the 3rd generation (Morafic, *Bint Mona, Ibn Hamama and Manaya) :laughing1:

#11 wildcat180

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 07:35 PM

Well, that was a fine example of the kind of "more info" I'm looking for. :laughing1: Basically, just the interesting pieces of information about the horses in the pedigree, like what you said about the dam being pure in strain. That wasn't on AK's site-or I didn't see it. How do you go about finding out stuff like that?

#12 Ray

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 08:49 PM

On the Al Khamsa website, follow the bottom-line female back to the Foundation Horse. The strain name and some other interesting info is found there.

p.s. you might ask Heidi to move this topic to the Discussion board, where it belongs. Might get more action from others that way.. :laughing1:




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