27 replies to this topic

[VanAlma]

Katy, I think you're a bit off. There have been people who have asked for help. There are people here who have stepped up and taken horses before they got into a bad situation. Those owners asked for help from multiple sources before it got bad. Once it gets that bad, people tend to be critical because no one knew about it and, therefore, the horses weren't helped in time. Then tax money has to pay for their seizure (sheriff / courts) and rescues get brought in and makes a HUGE mess. I'm not just talking about these women. I'm talking about all the people who have had massive herds confiscated due to an inability to care for them. Starvation does not happen over night. We're a tight-knit community and people have gone as far as to buy horses out of the kill pen (see Ramses herd) to keep the lines and horses as safe as possible. Does that mean all will be rescued that way? No. Some end up dying or being slaughtered. However, when people claim to love their horses and then watch them deteriorate without saying PLEASE HELP, I think we get critical on the tail end of the horses' destruction. It's like the student who won't go for extra help before a test, fails the test, and then cries because the teacher didn't help when the student didn't speak up. It defies logic. It really does. JMO.

[MagicImageArabians]

There have been many rumors, innuendos, and inaccurate information floating around. Rather than repeating everything here, please visit this post:   http://forums.arabia...192#entry611192

Before Cindy got her new job, I contacted a few people who had been interested in leasing those mares after they were already with Cindy, asking if they would be able to go get one or more before she ran out of hay.  The offer I made was not that the mare go back to West Virginia once she was back on her feet (as posted on another thread), but that Cindy be given an option to pay accrued board on the foal at weaning to get the foal back - not the mare!  A few people asked lots of questions and then would not even respond to let me know they had decided not to take one.  So much for the theory that people will help when asked!  Then Cindy got a new job and was able to continue feeding them.  Unfortunately, she left them in another's "care" while she worked 80+ hours a week.

Anyone with questions about the situation or who has "adopted" one of my horses, feel free to contact me.

Thanks!

[Tricia]

This is a prime example of why I will not lease a horse to anyone!  I do think it is unreasonable, however, to deny a previous owner the opportunity to get the horse back.  How heartbreaking for a breeder who thought a horse was going to a good forever home to learn of neglect and then not be able to rescue the horse.  I am speaking generally here, not necessarily about this particular situation.

[Desert Tag Arabians]

I would like to the location and condition of the other Saba horses owned by Rae Kerns.  If they are deteriorating in the same conditions as the ones we saw from the photos they need help.  Cindy---other than what you've already stated, can you tell us more about the other horses and if they need help?  I am not asking this to start a lynching party or drill up drama (remember, trying to swear off that stuff...LOL).  I sincerely hope if there are more horses in need someone will speak up and let them be saved.

[Angella]

"there but for the grace of God..?"  I dunno that I can get behind that statement.  You should know, always, what you can afford.  A good job is not enough to afford a large herd of horses in this day and age... you're merely flying by the seat of your pants.  It takes a good job and substantial wealth already accumulated... and good management of that wealth.

Further, for most of us who have smaller herds and solid ethics, we always have somebody we can turn to if we need it.  If I found myself in dire straits, I have friends and family who would help me... with feed, with placement of my horses (and yes, they would go for free before being starved to death), with whatever I needed.  I have people who would help me with trims and allow me to pay later.  My vet would come in the dead of night and wait for payment if necessary.  I have all of this because I take care to not screw the people around me... to be responsible for what I have... to protect my name, even as a newcomer... and to pay my bills.

Where there is a will, there is always a way to not own or care for half starved, scrawny, sick, animals.  And there is most definitely always a way for those half starved, scrawny, sick animals to not be pregnant.

[Desert Tag Arabians]

I also wanted to say this....there is a lesson to be learned from rescue situations like this one.  Actually, many lessons can be learned.  I like to think, if I should ever find myself unable to care for my horses, I would speak up SOON and LOUD and leave pride at the backdoor.  It has to be embarrassing to admit you can't care for your animals, and it leaves you open for criticism and can damage your reputation.  But, the horses are defenseless but for us.  If I couldn't feed my children, I'd say to hell with pride and do whatever I had to to make sure they didn't miss a single meal if I could help it.  Same for the horses.

And, on that note, if someone does seek help, we need to step back and bite back criticisms so we don't deter others from asking.  I say shame on anyone who lets their horses become emaciated without shouting from the rooftops to anyone who would listen--begging assistance or offering to give the horses away if they had no future recourse to care for them.  I don't place blame on those, however, who openly admit they are in a jam and ask for help.  I don't begrudge them owning horses or their judgement; we are all human and fallible and any one of us can fall on hard times unexpectedly.

Cindy asked a hypothetical question about turning in a friend or family member....I thought about this a lot before replying, although it has always been my intention to address her question.  IF I had a friend who could not care for an animal, I would first offer help, in whatever form I could manage.  But, if the horses continued to go hungry, and my friend did not speak up and try to rectify the situation, I can say quite confidentally that "yes" I would turn them in.  I would do the same if I had a friend or family member starving their children.  The defenseless, whether children or animals, have no hope without those who will look after their best interest.

[Desert Tag Arabians]

Angella-- We were posting at the same time.  Good points .  I also have friends, farrier and vet who will work with me should I ever need it, because I have built up a good relationship with them.

And you're right---if you can't care for your horses, have no plan to fix a bad situation, GIVE THEM AWAY!

[drquinndsa]

Just a note - not sure, but Amira Majiida may be a relation to Sal - El Majiid is Sal's sire. Any photos of her? Might be able to figure her out. As to the matter of paperwork - anyone who truly wants the best for the horses will indeed send them with their papers. Horses tend to do better in placement when they have some value to them, since it is not uncommon for all the good-hearted who RESCUE these horses, to at some point, have a need to sell or re-home such horses. Also, if these are SE horses, they why in the world would someone NOT want to see them used in breeding programs if desired by those who take the horses off their hands? Finally, I would be pretty ticked off if, after going through a rescue of someone's neglected horse - which we have more than once - a previous (and apparently unconcerned) owner shows up saying 'That's my horse!" It is only right that these horses go with their heritage. It is bad enough that they will take a ton of care and groceries to bring them back to health and speed, and that for the most part, the horses WE have encountered that need rescuing are not even TRAINED and so have NO use, but then the people who have put them in this position refuse to send them with papers. WHY? Whoever rescues them CLEARLY is not going "make a buck" reselling them in the condition most are found in. If, later, they DO end up with a salable, healthy horse, what is it to the person who neglected them? They don't deserve anything from the hard work of someone else. We rescued two horses who needed extreme care, and we gave it to them. One we gave to a terrific young rider who enjoyed this horse and kept her until her death. We made nothing on that transfer - and she went with papers. The other came to us with NO TRAINING and NO PAPERS. We had sufficient horses of our own, and as it turned out, it was VERY DIFFICULT to find a permanent home for this handsome and well bred gelding. We finally did, and he live out his life in peace.  So again, I ask, why would this person NOT send the horses along with papers? It is a part of what MIGHT earn the horses a better life. But for the grace of God? Indeed - but having been through the mill more than once, prudence must come into play BEFORE getting in such a position. The word hoarding comes to mind. I would LOVE to have one or two really well bred, saddle trained SE mares here, but a terrible market for even very good horses, and the fact that I have 6 ridable horses already, make it a bad decision. Would I take a reasonably healthy SE mare right now? Possibly. Without papers? Nope. It makes no sense, because at some point I would want to be able breed or ride or possibly sell, and without papers, none of that makes sense, or is even possible. If someone truly cares about the horses, no matter what circumstances forces their relocation, that person would send them with up to date paperwork.